US – Mexico Border.

[bats]

You can fill in the next eight pages of this rant, if you like.

No need. You've pretty much covered the main unproven (and disproven) conspiracy theories spread by Trump and his right-wing supporters.

And it's no surprise that right-wingers would claim that the only reason Trump couldn't make America great again in his first term is that everything was rigged against him. EVERYTHING Trump fails to do is because the opposition rigged the game against him. Jesus, the propaganda works wonders.

I could go over this point-by-point, but I don't think anyone who hasn't figured it out by now would be swayed.

[Hobby]

Aren't people complaining about Russia doing to to Ukraine?

Russia invaded Ukraine to take the land not because Ukrainians were migrating to Russia in droves and smuggling lethal drugs into Russia. The UnitedcStates has every right to stop illegals and drug trafficking anyway we can.  Biden diplomacy isn't and hasn't worked. 

[Blkfyre]

Russia invaded Ukraine to take the land not because Ukrainians were migrating to Russia in droves and smuggling lethal drugs into Russia. The UnitedcStates has every right to stop illegals and drug trafficking anyway we can.  Biden diplomacy isn't and hasn't worked. 

Stopping them at our borders sure. He proposed we just go into another country and make war on some of their citizens (criminals sure, but still their citizens) and justify that by "keeping our borders safe"

[Romanticlover]

Stopping them at our borders sure. He proposed we just go into another country and make war on some of their citizens (criminals sure, but still their citizens) and justify that by "keeping our borders safe"

Time for history...
In 1915 Pres Wilson(D) order the US Army to go into Mexico to capture banditos, that expeditionary force was commanded by Gen Pershing and George S Patton.

[Hobby]

Stopping them at our borders sure. He proposed we just go into another country and make war on some of their citizens (criminals sure, but still their citizens) and justify that by "keeping our borders safe"

Yes Trump should go in when the leaders of the country allow drug trafficking to take place having the US their prime customer.  So you would say terrorists are citizens despite all they have killed? Trump needs to send in our military to destroy the Cartel and make them an example what to expect if they kill Americans.

[Blkfyre]

Yes Trump should go in when the leaders of the country allow drug trafficking to take place having the US their prime customer.  So you would say terrorists are citizens despite all they have killed? Trump needs to send in our military to destroy the Cartel and make them an example what to expect if they kill Americans.

There are American citizens who have committed crimes against Mexico, who have facilitated those border crossings, who are just as responsible for the drug trade.

So you would be OK with Mexico sending troops into Texas and California and killing our citizens without regard for our laws or due process?

[Blkfyre]

Yes Trump should go in when the leaders of the country allow drug trafficking to take place having the US their prime customer.  So you would say terrorists are citizens despite all they have killed? Trump needs to send in our military to destroy the Cartel and make them an example what to expect if they kill Americans.

America is just as responsible for the drug trade, or do you think ONLY Mexican drug dealers are here? And yes, regardless of their crimes they are citizens, just like the American coyotes or drug mules or drug dealers are our citizens.

Stupidity or committing crimes doesn't strip your citizenship, or have you read about some laws someplace I have not?

[HighStepper]

Time for history...
In 1915 Pres Wilson(D) order the US Army to go into Mexico to capture banditos, that expeditionary force was commanded by Gen Pershing and George S Patton.

Thank you Romanticlover for that bit of history. I did not know that.

As part of a campaign against U.S. interests in Northern Mexico, Pancho Villa's forces attacked U.S. mining executives in Mexico on January 9, 1916, provoking public anger in the United States, especially in Texas. Villa's forces then raided the town of Columbus, New Mexico, on March 9, 1916, resulting in the death of sixteen Americans and much larger casualties for Villa's forces.

Brigadier General John J. Pershing led a force of 12,000 soldiers, cavalry, observation aircraft, and motorized supply vehicles into Mexico. The expedition penetrated 419 miles into Mexico, but failed to capture Villa. Villa's popularity grew as the Americans pursued him, and his band grew to about 5,000. Wilson ordered Pershing to withdraw in January 1917.

Wilson also attempted to appease Mexican President Venustiano Carranza by claiming that the raid was conducted "with scrupulous regard for the sovereignty of Mexico." Nevertheless, Carranza regarded Wilson's actions as a violation of Mexican sovereignty and refused to aid the U.S. expedition.

For more background see:  U.S. State Dept. Archive

[Blkfyre]

Time for history...
In 1915 Pres Wilson(D) order the US Army to go into Mexico to capture banditos, that expeditionary force was commanded by Gen Pershing and George S Patton.

Time for some history...

President Wilson was a racist who hated Black voters who had broken away from the Republican party to vote "progressive". He failed to address Jim Crow laws and his administration practiced active segrigation.

He also signed the 1924 National Origins Quota Act (A.K.A. The Johnson-Reed Act), the American government for the first time set strict limits on the number of immigrants permitted into the United States. Seeking to not only limit the number of immigrants but also the racial and ethnic make-up of those hoping to start a new life in the United States, the quotas deliberately targeted migrants from Asia, Eastern and Southern Europe who nativists argued were 'unfit' and unassimilable.

No wonder he had no problem sending in troops to take care of all the brown people...

Yes, this is someone we should want to emulate...Oh wait, that would be a perfect person a Trump fan would want to be like, my bad...

[Romanticlover]

I knew all that about Pres Wilson, he was a typical Democrat.
Now look up what Pres Lyndon Johnson(D) thought of black folks, the first Pres Johnson was also evil.

[Blkfyre]

I knew all that about Pres Wilson, he was a typical Democrat.
Now look up what Pres Lyndon Johnson(D) thought of black folks, the first Pres Johnson was also evil.

Wait, why are we changing the subject? You brought up Wilson as an example of us doing something patently illegal and it being ok because the President said so.

I replied showing that the President you wanted us to emulate now was a piece of trash person so why should we want to follow his example.

So why are we whatabouting away to another person?

[HighStepper]

No wonder he had no problem sending in troops to take care of all the brown people...

It is not as simple as claiming racism. The whole country was composed of "brown people." It was more about political alignment.

Pancho Villa, the Mexican revolutionary leader who controlled much of northeastern Mexico during 1914 and 1915, experienced military setbacks after breaking with the Carranza government and being subjected to a U.S. arms embargo. The Wilson Administration supported Carranza as the legitimate Mexican head of state and hoped that U.S. support could end Mexican political instability during the revolutionary period. Prior to the Mexican Revolution, the U.S.-Mexico border had been only lightly policed. The instability of the revolution led to an increased U.S. military presence, while U.S. citizens along the border often sympathized or aided the various factions in Mexico.
Again, For more background see:  U.S. State Dept. Archive

[Romanticlover]

Wait, why are we changing the subject? You brought up Wilson as an example of us doing something patently illegal and it being ok because the President said so.

I replied showing that the President you wanted us to emulate now was a piece of trash person so why should we want to follow his example.

So why are we whatabouting away to another person?

I was merely pointing out Wilson was a racist and actually sent troops into Mexico, Trump isn't President yet and hasn't sent troops into Mexico yet. What Wilson did was real but what Trump might do is hypothetical.

TDS is strong with some of you guys.

[Hobby]

Yes Johnson was a real piece of work.  He lied to the American people saying how well the US was doing in Vietnam.  Johnson was a racist for sure.  Times were much different when Wilson was president.  It is unfair to judge a president from over 100 years ago by today's standards. 

[Blkfyre]

It is not as simple as claiming racism. The whole country was composed of "brown people." It was more about political alignment.

Pancho Villa, the Mexican revolutionary leader who controlled much of northeastern Mexico during 1914 and 1915, experienced military setbacks after breaking with the Carranza government and being subjected to a U.S. arms embargo. The Wilson Administration supported Carranza as the legitimate Mexican head of state and hoped that U.S. support could end Mexican political instability during the revolutionary period. Prior to the Mexican Revolution, the U.S.-Mexico border had been only lightly policed. The instability of the revolution led to an increased U.S. military presence, while U.S. citizens along the border often sympathized or aided the various factions in Mexico.
Again, For more background see:  U.S. State Dept. Archive

Fair enough, but from your link:

"Wilson also attempted to mollify Mexican President Venustiano Carranza by claiming that the raid was conducted "with scrupulous regard for the sovereignty of Mexico." Nevertheless, Carranza regarded Wilson's actions as a violation of Mexican sovereignty and refused to aid the U.S. expedition."

So, they quite rightly thought that Wilson was violating their boarders and nation. Back in 1915 not a whole lot would have come from that but in 2024, it would be a different story.