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Quote from: Bande on Jun 17, 2022, 05:47 PMso you go by the word of someone who flip flops for the current agenda And has been paid off..
Falsie has been wrong and needs to be held accountable for his damage.

Funny thing.  Science doesn't claim to be right all the time. It is right AS OF NOW, and the actual scientific method which is used across all sciences says you present what you have and it's tested and it may be false, but you learn, change things and present again. So the current conservative anti-science thinking that science has to be perfect the first time out is just bunk

https://www.britannica.com/science/scientific-method

So we can say anything we want and claim anything we want until it gets proven false and then we can change our stance?

It seems anything goes these days.  Whatever anyone says is true! There's no more iiars in the world! Even if 2 people say things that are opposite of each other both are true!   Yippppeeee!

Quote from: thaikhan on Jun 17, 2022, 06:47 PMSo we can say anything we want and claim anything we want until it gets proven false and then we can change our stance?

Sure. As long as you believe it is correct, provide PROOF, not just opinions and are open to others critiquing you.

You have to be open to changing your mind when facts that contradict you are presented.

You have to admit you were wrong and affirm that the new facts are truth, then sure go for it...

Quote from: Blkfyre on Jun 17, 2022, 06:33 PMSo the current conservative anti-science thinking that science has to be perfect the first time out is just bunk

It's not anti-science it's pro-common sense and pro-logic.

Just because a person has a medical degree and publishes a study doesn't mean they are right, many medical studies don't get verified and published because of flaws.

The study is still ongoing as I said, it is a three-year long-term study, so the results won't be made public until then

You claimed Pfizer 80$ effective and I asked how they could know this and you replied you were in a study group...but your study group wont be published until the near future.  So how does your study group support what Pfizer claims...it can't. I would think if they told me I could not have booster shot I would know which group I was in... So the fact you are in a study group really means nothing at all.

Quote from: HighStepper on Jun 17, 2022, 11:53 AMI think we are past the political rhetoric. If you don't want to get a vaccine, then don't get one. It is as simple as that.
 
Vaccines are not 100% guaranteed that you won't get COVID. The studies show that vaccines keep people out of the hospitals and the morgues.  I've had my vaccine shots and booster. I will keep getting boosters when recommended. I have a family member that is immune compromised so it is important to me that I keep vaccinated. My choice.

There are no guarantees in life except dying or being bored to death by a Democrate. LOL

Quote from: Hobby on Jun 17, 2022, 08:17 PMThe study is still ongoing as I said, it is a three-year long-term study, so the results won't be made public until then

You claimed Pfizer 80$ effective and I asked how they could know this and you replied you were in a study group...but your study group wont be published until the near future.  So how does your study group support what Pfizer claims...it can't. I would think if they told me I could not have booster shot I would know which group I was in... So the fact you are in a study group really means nothing at all.

You stopped reading where I said they report to the FDA monthly who verified their data, you know, what you said a study needs in order to be true.

And no they didn't tell people individually, when they were going to be testing the booster they told EVERYONE in the study about the upcoming booster and that everyone had the choice of continuing or dropping out. If they continued they would be informed whether they got the real deal or the placebo. You were not told until you decided if you were in or out.

Quote from: Romanticlover on Jun 17, 2022, 08:13 PMIt's not anti-science it's pro-common sense and pro-logic.

Just because a person has a medical degree and publishes a study doesn't mean they are right, many medical studies don't get verified and published because of flaws.

Funnily enough, that is EXACTLY WHAT THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD IS FOR!  If you had bothered to click the link I proved you would have seen that. And again, unlike you who believes there is right and wrong and nothing in between science says we know what we know until it's disproven. For instance science said man could not fly, until it did. Science said man couldn't go to the moon, until it did, etc.

I am not going to try to convince you that the scientific method is what EVERY scientist uses. If you want to deny a basic tenant go ahead. It doesn't make it any less valid.

Quote from: Blkfyre on Jun 17, 2022, 08:41 PMYou stopped reading where I said they report to the FDA monthly who verified their data, you know, what you said a study needs in order to be true.

And no they didn't tell people individually, when they were going to be testing the booster they told EVERYONE in the study about the upcoming booster and that everyone had the choice of continuing or dropping out. If they continued they would be informed whether they got the real deal or the placebo. You were not told until you decided if you were in or out.

But the study could not determine the effectiveness until the study concludes is my point... so there is no way you can substantiate Pfizer's 80% claim.

Quote from: Romanticlover on Jun 17, 2022, 08:13 PMIt's not anti-science it's pro-common sense and pro-logic.

Just because a person has a medical degree and publishes a study doesn't mean they are right, many medical studies don't get verified and published because of flaws.

Many don't get published if those that don't want the truth known out there.  Take breast implants...study after study said how safe they are... well the are not, studies are now being published about the dangers... Remember back in the 80s studies came out that aspirin was bad for you and now studies shows aspirin can save lives, and prevent or stop heart attacks... so medical studies really don't mean much.

Quote from: Hobby on Jun 17, 2022, 08:50 PMBut the study could not determine the effectiveness until the study concludes is my point... so there is no way you can substantiate Pfizer's 80% claim.

Effectiveness isn't binary: ONLY applicable after the study. I told you they reported monthly to the FDA which means that the totals were from live data, and up to date.

Nobody cares about COVID anymore and they aren't going to line up to get their 6 mo-5 year old jabbed with the vaccine.
Inflation and crime is out of control, their 401k is losing money and their home prices and wages are stagnant....COVID is way down on the list of what Americans care about.

Quote from: Blkfyre on Jun 17, 2022, 09:31 PMEffectiveness isn't binary: ONLY applicable after the study. I told you they reported monthly to the FDA which means that the totals were from live data, and up to date.

The truth is the study you participated in had no bearing on Pfizer's claim at the time. So you wanted to make the study you participated in was as support to their claim but your reasoning is faulty.  Not enough historical data for them to know how effective.  Lab tests performed on the covid virus probably were and are effective but how it plays out in the human body is another story and the need for human studies.

Quote from: Romanticlover on Jun 17, 2022, 09:42 PMNobody cares about COVID anymore and they aren't going to line up to get their 6 mo-5 year old jabbed with the vaccine.
Inflation and crime is out of control, their 401k is losing money and their home prices and wages are stagnant....COVID is way down on the list of what Americans care about.

I don't know they don't care about Covid, I won't say that, probably more worried about inflation, their job, and how they will pay their bills.  Another pandemic or mutation more deadly than Covid could be looming in near future. Are we prepared?